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Topic: Well its getting down to it...
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DaRk QuEen
In Your Dreams
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N. Korea warns against sanctions
SEOUL, Jan. 7 — A defiant North Korea warned Tuesday that economic sanctions over its nuclear program would “mean a war” and that Washington should sit down to talks, hours after the United States suggested that dialogue with Pyongyang was still an option. In Washington, meanwhile, South Korea and Japan prepared to resume talks on how to defuse a crisis that is threatening their security.
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"Oh What A Tangled Web We Weave,
When One First Pratices To Deceive"
Posts: 2280 (0.35 per day) | From: North Carolina, USA | Registered: Oct 2001 (6336 days)
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Bronx 
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It just bizarre how isolated a country can get with such a paranoid leader and government, but leading the world to this so fast is just unbelievable ... Words like this are scary, North Korea could never win but being the way they are they would leave significant damage on the world.
I often have a sense of foreboding about events like this, most of them have been false … but you never know how things will develop …
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Posts: 9347 (1.5 per day) | From: Gloucestershire, England | Registered: Feb 2002 (6210 days)
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-ReDeeMeR
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Clinton knew exactly how to deal with N Korea. Bush made a mistake including N Korea in the axis of evil (couldn’t he keep this belief to himself), now N Koreas leader knows all to well that the USA is going to attack someday, this just wasnt the case with the old administration, therefore he is anything but crazy.
The way I see it N Korea is confronting the states while its concentration is on IRAQ to extract a no war treaty, building up nukes is a good way of achieving this.
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Posts: 5617 (0.86 per day) | From: Anytown | Registered: May 2001 (6485 days)
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-ReDeeMeR
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Well it now seems Bush blinked first buy offering North Korea dialogue, he has now gone back on his word and sold out to korea.
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Posts: 5617 (0.86 per day) | From: Anytown | Registered: May 2001 (6485 days)
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Bronx
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quote:
Originally posted by ReDeeMeR:
Well it now seems Bush blinked first buy offering North Korea dialogue, he has now gone back on his word and sold out to korea.
Iraq does not have one of the largest land army's and does not have nukes trained on S Korea, Japan etc ... Korea does not have oil.
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Posts: 9347 (1.5 per day) | From: Gloucestershire, England | Registered: Feb 2002 (6210 days)
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-gbotto600-
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If North Korea thinks they can achieve anything they are stupider than previously thought
if they try anything a rain of nuclear missiles will send them further back than they already are
its a case of a tin-pot dictator trying to get attentionby telling the world he is "bad" and has "nukes"
god speed to the south koreans, any war on communism is just and holy
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Decima MAS
  \
When ancient Rome was near defeat,
the invincible Tenth Legion was raised:
they beat the barbarians on the battlefield
and Rome gained peace with honour again.
When the traitor, on September the eighth,
left the fatherland in infamy,
the Tenth Flotilla was raised from the sea
and it brought weapons at the cry for honour!
Oh our Tenth Flotilla,
you that mocked England,
you victorious on Alexandria,
Malta, Souda and Gibraltar,
you already victorious upon the sea,
now even on the dry land
you will win!
To you Italian ships, stolen from us
not in battle but by treason,
and to you, our prisoners and dead brothers,
we swear:
we swear that we'll came back,
let this be God's and the Flag's will.
We swear that we'll fight
until we obtain an honourable peace!
Posts: 7713 (1.19 per day) | From: NJ | Registered: May 2001 (6472 days)
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Bronx
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by -gbotto600-:
If North Korea thinks they can achieve anything they are stupider than previously thought
if they try anything a rain of nuclear missiles will send them further back than they already are
its a case of a tin-pot dictator trying to get attentionby telling the world he is "bad" and has "nukes"
god speed to the south koreans, any war on communism is just and holy
Yeah, N korea doesnt have that many nukes anyway, I beleive most are at most medium range. So true about the tin-pot dictator flexing his muscles, it proves how out of touch and isolated N Korea is using tactics that are decades old.
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Posts: 9347 (1.5 per day) | From: Gloucestershire, England | Registered: Feb 2002 (6210 days)
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-gbotto600-
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It probably came to him (the NK leader, i cant remeber his name) that while he holds massive parades and touts the "communist system!" the rest of asia is developing rapidly and has massive wealth/power/solid economies, imagine if you were in the NK's leadership, you look at South Korea, China, Japan, they must be extremely jealous of that much wealth and technology while they are the lowest power
This is their way of "evening the playingfield", they are saying basically to South Korea/Japan: "You may have tons of money, food, technology, etc.. but we have some nuclear weapons so respect us!"
Its their pleading for attention on the international stage, the rest of asia has left them behind and they are trying to catch up
[ January 07, 2003, 22:33: Message edited by: -gbotto600- ]
--------------------
Decima MAS
\
When ancient Rome was near defeat,
the invincible Tenth Legion was raised:
they beat the barbarians on the battlefield
and Rome gained peace with honour again.
When the traitor, on September the eighth,
left the fatherland in infamy,
the Tenth Flotilla was raised from the sea
and it brought weapons at the cry for honour!
Oh our Tenth Flotilla,
you that mocked England,
you victorious on Alexandria,
Malta, Souda and Gibraltar,
you already victorious upon the sea,
now even on the dry land
you will win!
To you Italian ships, stolen from us
not in battle but by treason,
and to you, our prisoners and dead brothers,
we swear:
we swear that we'll came back,
let this be God's and the Flag's will.
We swear that we'll fight
until we obtain an honourable peace!
Posts: 7713 (1.19 per day) | From: NJ | Registered: May 2001 (6472 days)
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Bronx
Administrator
Member # 402
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I totally agree ... N Korea were getting help from China on creating a Hong Kong of their own, in otherwords like a business district/country that is pure capitalist, has its own money, laws etc.
This is just absolute proof that communism does not work, as nice and romantic as the ideals are they have to boost their regimes with money from capitalist venture ... why dont they just cut their losses and join the developed world?
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Posts: 9347 (1.5 per day) | From: Gloucestershire, England | Registered: Feb 2002 (6210 days)
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-gbotto600-
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posted
quote:
why dont they just cut their losses and join the developed world?
too much pride that would have to be swallowed i guess
--------------------
Decima MAS
\
When ancient Rome was near defeat,
the invincible Tenth Legion was raised:
they beat the barbarians on the battlefield
and Rome gained peace with honour again.
When the traitor, on September the eighth,
left the fatherland in infamy,
the Tenth Flotilla was raised from the sea
and it brought weapons at the cry for honour!
Oh our Tenth Flotilla,
you that mocked England,
you victorious on Alexandria,
Malta, Souda and Gibraltar,
you already victorious upon the sea,
now even on the dry land
you will win!
To you Italian ships, stolen from us
not in battle but by treason,
and to you, our prisoners and dead brothers,
we swear:
we swear that we'll came back,
let this be God's and the Flag's will.
We swear that we'll fight
until we obtain an honourable peace!
Posts: 7713 (1.19 per day) | From: NJ | Registered: May 2001 (6472 days)
| IP: Logged |
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DaRk QuEen
In Your Dreams
Member # 254
Member Rated:
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posted
well regardless I think the US maybe taking on more then necessary...I think IF we gotta battle, then one place at a time...and now it looks like war with Iraq will happen....cuz US are sending in many troops...and
U.S. battle planners to go to Qatar
The U.S. military command that would oversee a war against Iraq is sending much of its battle staff to a Persian Gulf base equipped to coordinate a large-scale land, sea and air war, officials said Tuesday.
ok now i have a question....about the missles that were being discussed earlier...how far away is medium ranged? and large ranged?
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"Oh What A Tangled Web We Weave,
When One First Pratices To Deceive"
Posts: 2280 (0.35 per day) | From: North Carolina, USA | Registered: Oct 2001 (6336 days)
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Bronx
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by DaRk QuEen:
ok now i have a question....about the missles that were being discussed earlier...how far away is medium ranged? and large ranged?
I dont think it will come to war with NK, they have played their game and got the world to listen ... I think botto is more than qualified to answer the missile question, my answer would only be of limited knowledge. Basically NK have the ability to hit Japan, SKorea and parts of China ...
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Posts: 9347 (1.5 per day) | From: Gloucestershire, England | Registered: Feb 2002 (6210 days)
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2-D..
Does this rag smell like chloroform to you?
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posted
from what i can tell if iraq had squds it could fire them from iraq and could hit some of turkey and isreal but not much futher so by the sounds of it junglist is right, but im waiting for botto to prove me wrong...
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*Coming soon: Something so awesome to look at it will make your eyeballs explode*
Posts: 6460 (1 per day) | From: Hadleys Hope | Registered: Jun 2001 (6448 days)
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-gbotto600-
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This is the NK missile that is causng all the controversey:
http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/dprk/missile/nd-1.htm
Range: 1000KM Major Citys in that area: Tokyo, Taipei, anywhere in South Korea
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Iraqi scuds:
Scud is an ancient system first off, its guidance is terrible and the missiles are very unrealible, during the Gulf War alot of them never made it to their targets and simply "fell apart" from shoddy welds and bolts
Here is some info on "Scud"
Scud is a "threater" system, it was desigend to be used by Soviet Army Fronts in the Cold War to bombard NATO depots, bases, command facilities, air-bases with nuclear payloads, it is not designed to hit cities, it is a "battlefield weapon", Iraq tried to use them as "city busters" with conventional payloads but this wasnt so successful
Its guidance is ancient and like i said before, the realibity (ESP: of iraqi ones) is in much doubt
Their ranges are all less than 800km, targets in Israel, Suadi Arabia, are all possible, along with parts of Turkey, but i think the major populated Turkish cities are far from the range
--------------------
Decima MAS
\
When ancient Rome was near defeat,
the invincible Tenth Legion was raised:
they beat the barbarians on the battlefield
and Rome gained peace with honour again.
When the traitor, on September the eighth,
left the fatherland in infamy,
the Tenth Flotilla was raised from the sea
and it brought weapons at the cry for honour!
Oh our Tenth Flotilla,
you that mocked England,
you victorious on Alexandria,
Malta, Souda and Gibraltar,
you already victorious upon the sea,
now even on the dry land
you will win!
To you Italian ships, stolen from us
not in battle but by treason,
and to you, our prisoners and dead brothers,
we swear:
we swear that we'll came back,
let this be God's and the Flag's will.
We swear that we'll fight
until we obtain an honourable peace!
Posts: 7713 (1.19 per day) | From: NJ | Registered: May 2001 (6472 days)
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-gbotto600-
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posted
quote:
and large ranged?
I guess you mean ICBMS? (inter-contiental-ballastic-missile)
These are designed as "city busters"
Here are the Russian and American ones:
Peacekeeper
USA
Range: 6,000+ miles (Most parts of the planet, esp: anywhere in Russia)
Most of these missiles are deployed in Wyoming, North Dakota, Montana etc... the idea being if the Russians ever tried to hit hte missile silos, they would be far from cities
Russian ICBMS:
Range: Most parts of the planet, esp: anywhere in USA/Europe
SS-18 'Satan' is the most powerful ICBM ever built:
That is one in its 'Launch Canister'
It carries/carried either 1x 20 megaton warhead (extremely powerful) or 10x .8 megaton warheads (for targeting more than one target area)
---
These weapons along with the Sub-Launched weapons and Air-Dropped weapons are IMO the true nuclear holocaust, compared to these weapons, the NK and Iraqi nukes would be if anything, childs-play but even that is still scary
--------------------
Decima MAS
\
When ancient Rome was near defeat,
the invincible Tenth Legion was raised:
they beat the barbarians on the battlefield
and Rome gained peace with honour again.
When the traitor, on September the eighth,
left the fatherland in infamy,
the Tenth Flotilla was raised from the sea
and it brought weapons at the cry for honour!
Oh our Tenth Flotilla,
you that mocked England,
you victorious on Alexandria,
Malta, Souda and Gibraltar,
you already victorious upon the sea,
now even on the dry land
you will win!
To you Italian ships, stolen from us
not in battle but by treason,
and to you, our prisoners and dead brothers,
we swear:
we swear that we'll came back,
let this be God's and the Flag's will.
We swear that we'll fight
until we obtain an honourable peace!
Posts: 7713 (1.19 per day) | From: NJ | Registered: May 2001 (6472 days)
| IP: Logged |
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-gbotto600-
Addicted Member
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posted
Chinese ICBM
DF-4
Range: 12,000-15,000 KM (Main targets are Korea, Japan, Most of Russia, USA, Taiwan, Australia)
Warhead: 2 megatons (thats pretty powerful)
Compared to US and Russian systems this missile isnt as good or reliable, but with a 2 megaton warhead you only have to hit within a mile or so of your target to cause major damage
[ January 08, 2003, 18:34: Message edited by: -gbotto600- ]
--------------------
Decima MAS
\
When ancient Rome was near defeat,
the invincible Tenth Legion was raised:
they beat the barbarians on the battlefield
and Rome gained peace with honour again.
When the traitor, on September the eighth,
left the fatherland in infamy,
the Tenth Flotilla was raised from the sea
and it brought weapons at the cry for honour!
Oh our Tenth Flotilla,
you that mocked England,
you victorious on Alexandria,
Malta, Souda and Gibraltar,
you already victorious upon the sea,
now even on the dry land
you will win!
To you Italian ships, stolen from us
not in battle but by treason,
and to you, our prisoners and dead brothers,
we swear:
we swear that we'll came back,
let this be God's and the Flag's will.
We swear that we'll fight
until we obtain an honourable peace!
Posts: 7713 (1.19 per day) | From: NJ | Registered: May 2001 (6472 days)
| IP: Logged |
|
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DaRk QuEen
In Your Dreams
Member # 254
Member Rated:
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posted
wow thanks for all the information....Now I heard we have detectors that can detect a incomming missle and we would be able to shoot it out of the sky before it lands... I head that we really don't have a blind spot that umm you know like water, sea level and air...you know how some movies you can fly low and not be detected by radar? so do you know if the US is able to detect all of it?
hope ya know what i'm trying to ask :S
--------------------
"Oh What A Tangled Web We Weave,
When One First Pratices To Deceive"
Posts: 2280 (0.35 per day) | From: North Carolina, USA | Registered: Oct 2001 (6336 days)
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-gbotto600-
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Yeah, the US and most other nuclear powers have RADAR and satellities that can detect a nuclear launch within seconds of it happening, ICBMs cant really travel low to avoid RADAR (the idea of flying "low" to avoid RADAR is becuase RADAR signals get screwed up in low areas becuase they reflect off hills, houses, mountains etc.. that is referred to as 'ground clutter') most ICBMS fly into space orbit and then seperate their warhead to descend so its quite easy to detect them and caclaute their trajectory and thus figure where they are hitting.
As for shooting one down, that is what Bush is trying to get money for, IMO it is a waste becuase we dont have the nessecary technology (IMO) to make it work.
There are several ideas about how it could work, the most likely to work is a "kinetic kill", where another missile is used to shoot down the ICBM in its launch phase, the problem is getting the missile to hit the ICBM. The Israeli's have recently done some successful tests with their Arrow system and the US had some successful tests but it still needs alot of testing.
The US also has used LASERs to shoot down test rockets but that is still decades away.
So in short , Yes we can detect missiles upon their launch and calcuate their targets and time to impact, but No we cant really shoot down a missile with any success.
And 'flying low' wouldnt really work for a nuclear ICBM since they need alot of altitude and most require "orbital entry", BUT an aircraft carrying a nuclear weapon may be able to fly low enough to escape RADAR and some cruise missile systems are nuclear capable (they can fly low)
[ January 09, 2003, 11:42: Message edited by: -gbotto600- ]
--------------------
Decima MAS
\
When ancient Rome was near defeat,
the invincible Tenth Legion was raised:
they beat the barbarians on the battlefield
and Rome gained peace with honour again.
When the traitor, on September the eighth,
left the fatherland in infamy,
the Tenth Flotilla was raised from the sea
and it brought weapons at the cry for honour!
Oh our Tenth Flotilla,
you that mocked England,
you victorious on Alexandria,
Malta, Souda and Gibraltar,
you already victorious upon the sea,
now even on the dry land
you will win!
To you Italian ships, stolen from us
not in battle but by treason,
and to you, our prisoners and dead brothers,
we swear:
we swear that we'll came back,
let this be God's and the Flag's will.
We swear that we'll fight
until we obtain an honourable peace!
Posts: 7713 (1.19 per day) | From: NJ | Registered: May 2001 (6472 days)
| IP: Logged |
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-gbotto600-
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posted
Here are some good links:
ICBM Missile Basics
Short Range (Theater) Ballastic Missiles (EXP: Scud)
Cruise Missiles
Nuclear Payloads on Aircraft
Bush's Missile Defense Ideas
--------------------
Decima MAS
\
When ancient Rome was near defeat,
the invincible Tenth Legion was raised:
they beat the barbarians on the battlefield
and Rome gained peace with honour again.
When the traitor, on September the eighth,
left the fatherland in infamy,
the Tenth Flotilla was raised from the sea
and it brought weapons at the cry for honour!
Oh our Tenth Flotilla,
you that mocked England,
you victorious on Alexandria,
Malta, Souda and Gibraltar,
you already victorious upon the sea,
now even on the dry land
you will win!
To you Italian ships, stolen from us
not in battle but by treason,
and to you, our prisoners and dead brothers,
we swear:
we swear that we'll came back,
let this be God's and the Flag's will.
We swear that we'll fight
until we obtain an honourable peace!
Posts: 7713 (1.19 per day) | From: NJ | Registered: May 2001 (6472 days)
| IP: Logged |
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Bronx
Administrator
Member # 402
Member Rated:
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by -gbotto600-:
As for shooting one down, that is what Bush is trying to get money for, IMO it is a waste becuase we dont have the nessecary technology (IMO) to make it work.
Well when you start building them, you will have some over here to ...
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Posts: 9347 (1.5 per day) | From: Gloucestershire, England | Registered: Feb 2002 (6210 days)
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-gbotto600-
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posted
?
--------------------
Decima MAS
\
When ancient Rome was near defeat,
the invincible Tenth Legion was raised:
they beat the barbarians on the battlefield
and Rome gained peace with honour again.
When the traitor, on September the eighth,
left the fatherland in infamy,
the Tenth Flotilla was raised from the sea
and it brought weapons at the cry for honour!
Oh our Tenth Flotilla,
you that mocked England,
you victorious on Alexandria,
Malta, Souda and Gibraltar,
you already victorious upon the sea,
now even on the dry land
you will win!
To you Italian ships, stolen from us
not in battle but by treason,
and to you, our prisoners and dead brothers,
we swear:
we swear that we'll came back,
let this be God's and the Flag's will.
We swear that we'll fight
until we obtain an honourable peace!
Posts: 7713 (1.19 per day) | From: NJ | Registered: May 2001 (6472 days)
| IP: Logged |
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Bronx
Administrator
Member # 402
Member Rated:
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by -gbotto600-:
?
The missile defence system ... Bush wants to put some in England ...
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Posts: 9347 (1.5 per day) | From: Gloucestershire, England | Registered: Feb 2002 (6210 days)
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-gbotto600-
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posted
Ohh
--------------------
Decima MAS
\
When ancient Rome was near defeat,
the invincible Tenth Legion was raised:
they beat the barbarians on the battlefield
and Rome gained peace with honour again.
When the traitor, on September the eighth,
left the fatherland in infamy,
the Tenth Flotilla was raised from the sea
and it brought weapons at the cry for honour!
Oh our Tenth Flotilla,
you that mocked England,
you victorious on Alexandria,
Malta, Souda and Gibraltar,
you already victorious upon the sea,
now even on the dry land
you will win!
To you Italian ships, stolen from us
not in battle but by treason,
and to you, our prisoners and dead brothers,
we swear:
we swear that we'll came back,
let this be God's and the Flag's will.
We swear that we'll fight
until we obtain an honourable peace!
Posts: 7713 (1.19 per day) | From: NJ | Registered: May 2001 (6472 days)
| IP: Logged |
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Cloynez0r
Member
Member # 534
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posted
i didnt read the whole topic
but i can guarentee at least 2 wars from bush, and the united states in ruin. bush will be the Nero of the united states
(nero was the insane Roman empire who added to its decline)
ever think about how the Roman(or any other) empire compares to the US? They all ended with a war or a bad leader...we have both.
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![[z06]](graemlins/z06.gif)
![[huepfenicon111]](graemlins/huepfenicon111.gif)
Posts: 2895 (0.47 per day) | From: TeXaN PridE | Registered: May 2002 (6122 days)
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-gbotto600-
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@arkan: i'd rather work for the NSA or CIA
@cloyne: Caliguia was worse, nero was bad none-the-less but he was very interested also in art, music, poetry etc.. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
--------------------
Decima MAS
\
When ancient Rome was near defeat,
the invincible Tenth Legion was raised:
they beat the barbarians on the battlefield
and Rome gained peace with honour again.
When the traitor, on September the eighth,
left the fatherland in infamy,
the Tenth Flotilla was raised from the sea
and it brought weapons at the cry for honour!
Oh our Tenth Flotilla,
you that mocked England,
you victorious on Alexandria,
Malta, Souda and Gibraltar,
you already victorious upon the sea,
now even on the dry land
you will win!
To you Italian ships, stolen from us
not in battle but by treason,
and to you, our prisoners and dead brothers,
we swear:
we swear that we'll came back,
let this be God's and the Flag's will.
We swear that we'll fight
until we obtain an honourable peace!
Posts: 7713 (1.19 per day) | From: NJ | Registered: May 2001 (6472 days)
| IP: Logged |
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Cloynez0r
Member
Member # 534
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posted
quote:
Originally posted by -gbotto600-:
@arkan: i'd rather work for the NSA or CIA
@cloyne: Caliguia was worse, nero was bad none-the-less but he was very interested also in art, music, poetry etc..
in an insane way
some retarded adults like to color & connect the dots...does that make them good leaders?
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Posts: 2895 (0.47 per day) | From: TeXaN PridE | Registered: May 2002 (6122 days)
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-gbotto600-
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posted
street sweeper baby
--------------------
Decima MAS
\
When ancient Rome was near defeat,
the invincible Tenth Legion was raised:
they beat the barbarians on the battlefield
and Rome gained peace with honour again.
When the traitor, on September the eighth,
left the fatherland in infamy,
the Tenth Flotilla was raised from the sea
and it brought weapons at the cry for honour!
Oh our Tenth Flotilla,
you that mocked England,
you victorious on Alexandria,
Malta, Souda and Gibraltar,
you already victorious upon the sea,
now even on the dry land
you will win!
To you Italian ships, stolen from us
not in battle but by treason,
and to you, our prisoners and dead brothers,
we swear:
we swear that we'll came back,
let this be God's and the Flag's will.
We swear that we'll fight
until we obtain an honourable peace!
Posts: 7713 (1.19 per day) | From: NJ | Registered: May 2001 (6472 days)
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